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Post by Deleted on Dec 31, 2020 11:27:56 GMT -5
I recently acquired a faulty Pioneer VSX-2021, which has no audio out on any speakers, headphones or pre-out terminals.
I have checked power supply voltages and all are present and correct to the manual so after some reading online I now suspect the TI DSP chip is the fault as with other models, such as the VSX-LX55 and Onkyo AV receivers.
I've tried the amp on CD input and Pure Direct but still now sound either. A firmware update via network fails at 20% every time but I cannot find a file to load via USB. If anyone has firmware for this unit I would be grateful.
I have good soldering skills with surface mount but have never tackled BGA devices before, so this will be a first for me. The plan is to replace the D810K013BZKB4 with the newer D810K013DZKB4 version.
There are plenty of suppliers on eBay for the 'B' variant which I am reluctant to fit due to the known premature aging issue but I am having trouble locating the 'D' variant.
Can anyone point me at a good supplier for this part and any other tips for fixing this fault other than the DSP chip?
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Post by tibimakai on Jan 4, 2021 18:27:23 GMT -5
I would try reheating it first, with a hot air station.
I don't have experience with Pioneers, but if it is the same as with Onkyo, then even the USB could be offline.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 5, 2021 13:44:17 GMT -5
Thanks for the reply - I have a hot air station but I've not tried this yet as I wanted to try and be as sure as I can what the problem is.
When I attempt the firmware update, it fails at 20% and the version number displays *** instead of numbers but I don't know what this indicates. I don't have a file to try by USB as I can't find it online, so this is by Ethernet cable/internet download.
I have located and bought a 'D' variant DSP chip from a Chinese supplier but reading on here this isn't likely to be a new device as claimed but a re-balled and remarked 'B' variant, which may or may not work.
To add to my problems, I've never swapped a BGA device before, so it will be a high risk repair for me. On the other hand, it doesn't work as it is, so what do I have to lose by trying?
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Post by tibimakai on Jan 5, 2021 14:08:15 GMT -5
Usually, when USB is not available it is grayed out.
I don't think, it is a good idea to do firmware upgrades, since some of the IC "legs"(balls) are not connected, it won't work, or will do more damage. It will corrupt the existing firmware.
I'm just like you, I don't know much about these stuff, usually I stick to amp repairs.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2021 5:23:32 GMT -5
I have tried heating the DSP chip with plenty of liquid flux flowed under it but it hasn't made any difference.
The firmware update fails at 20% with the message 'Update Error 1'.
I work in aerospace electronics as a test and repair technician but these AV amps are a nightmare to fault find.
I will try fitting the replacement DSP chip when it arrives. If that fails I will break it and sell the parts on eBay. I found with broken TVs that they are worth more that way than as a complete but faulty unit.
It will be a shame to do that but it is really beyond my skills to fix and isn't worth the expense paying to have it done even if I can find someone to do so.
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Post by tibimakai on Jan 6, 2021 18:15:18 GMT -5
There a bunch of Onkyo, Pioneer receivers with dsp chip issues.
In my opinion it's not worth selling boards. People use them in there devices, and if they won't work they want their money back.
After that, you have no idea, if that board is any good.
I used to repair TVs as well, but it's not worth it anymore.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 7, 2021 3:10:50 GMT -5
Don't worry, if I go down that route the boards will be sold with a clear statement that they are for spares or repairs only and should be considered as not working. They might be useful to someone for parts.
I'm fairly sure it's the main HDMI digital board that has a fault but it's unlikely I'll find a used working one and a new one will be ridiculously expensive even if it's available.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 12, 2021 12:06:35 GMT -5
In case anyone else is following this thread I found a download source for the latest firmware for the VSX-2021 / VSX-LX55 and associated models. The service manual shows the base model as VSX53 and putting this into Google came up with a website: www.touslesdrivers.com/index.php?v_page=23&v_code=42670It has 2 download links, one broken one to Pioneer, who appear to have stopped support and one from the host site. That one works and the firmware version is: 1-204-087-119-063 My receiver recognised this and started to load it but failed at 20% as usual, which is the DSP part according to the service manual. Hopefully if I am sucessful in fitting a new DSP BGA, I will be able to upload this fully. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 25, 2021 17:01:45 GMT -5
My BGA replacement attempt failed... I'm not sure if I bought a defective chip from China or it was my lack of skill at installing it.
What I need is someone who offers a BGA replacement service in the UK at a reasonable price. Any takers??
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Post by tjmotter on Jan 26, 2021 6:56:27 GMT -5
Note, I have bought over 20 of these BGA's from eBay and Ali. EVERY ONE OF THEM WAS FAKE! I have a post on this forum somewhere where I describe the fakes but they all fall into the same category. The vendor will scrape the top layer off of a bad "B" rev chip, reball the BGA and print a new logo on the top. When they arrive you will find that the DTS logo is wrong and that the imprint in one of the corners is either gone or clearly cut down. A new TI chip has 4 indentations on the chip and in one of them will be a raised alpha numeric code. This code should have firm peaks but when you buy from eBay or Ali these peaks will be cut down. Essentially you are buying junk. I even reached out to the TI headquarters on this and they informed me that they cannot sell this chip to anyone except large manufacturers due to licensing issues so anything you find will be a fake. The only solution I have found is to buy a broken board with the newer rev chip (like an NR626), remove it, reball it and install it.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 26, 2021 11:07:14 GMT -5
OK, so I may well have installed it sucessfully but the replacement chip was fake and possibly no good anyway? Looking at it under a magnifier it does look identical to the original, so it may be a salvaged and reballed part that I've been sent.
I'd like to get this board fixed if possible but I don't have the equipment or know how to reball a salvaged chip myself. Where are you based and do you do this as a repair service at all?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 27, 2021 7:16:01 GMT -5
I've had a look on eBay for Onkyo boards but I don't know what part numbers to search for that will have the newer rev BGA device.
I don't mind spending money on buying some equipment to reball a used device but I will have to learn how to do it as well.
It surprises me no one is offering this kind of service and unless I can successfully replace the chip I'll probably end up having to scrap £800 receiver for the sake of a £30 part.
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alm
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Post by alm on Jan 28, 2021 9:33:06 GMT -5
OK, so I may well have installed it sucessfully but the replacement chip was fake and possibly no good anyway? Looking at it under a magnifier it does look identical to the original, so it may be a salvaged and reballed part that I've been sent. I'd like to get this board fixed if possible but I don't have the equipment or know how to reball a salvaged chip myself. Where are you based and do you do this as a repair service at all? The rev "D" parts also suffer from failures and it's not bga solder problem... Installing a rev "D" part even from a working unit it's not a warranty that you will not have problems anymore just that will maybe last a bit longer... I alredy get rev "D" parts with less than 5000h and fail. The "B" parts fali with even less time 1100h or less especially on devices that dsp gets really hot like 509,414, and others that have only a single dsp. The only case that this devices last more seems when almost no audio processing are done by a secondary cirrus dsp like 646 and others. This is my experience in reparing more than 80 boards last year. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2021 10:11:34 GMT -5
I seems my choice of AVR to repair was a poor one simply because it has this particular DSP chip in it? There also doesn't appear to be any easy fix that gives long term reliability either?
The VSX-2021 I have has logged over 30,000 hours before I bought it and is a single DSP design using the TI 'B' variant, so it did quite well considering the low hours you have seen on others. I do not of course know if the board or chip had been previously replaced or repaired under warranty
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alm
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Post by alm on Jan 28, 2021 11:18:12 GMT -5
I seems my choice of AVR to repair was a poor one simply because it has this particular DSP chip in it? There also doesn't appear to be any easy fix that gives long term reliability either? The VSX-2021 I have has logged over 30,000 hours before I bought it and is a single DSP design using the TI 'B' variant, so it did quite well considering the low hours you have seen on others. I do not of course know if the board or chip had been previously replaced or repaired under warranty Replacing the dsp with "a good or working" chip will give a extended life but it will not last 20 years. But you need the right tools to make the replacement since this parts are quite sensitive to heat. Also need to take care of the nand/nor memory heat expose that can also lead to data loss. |
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